? on toilet or septic?

[shadow]

We moved into a 10 year old home and one night after one week of living here the downstairs toilet wouldn't flush. My husband used the plunger on it but it didn't go down. Then he used the toilet upstairs and flushed and the downstairs toilet starting emptying out all over the floor. He called a plumber (more like rip-off artist) who never went inside-said the problem was in the leachfield/septic area. He dug up the cover on septic and leach field and pushed on the dirt with a broomstick handle and the toilet instantly flushed and the clog was gone. However, he told us we had serious problems and came back the next a.m. and dug up the leachfield and broke the first chamber of the leach field. We had to call the health inspector who said the problem was only a leaking toilet and the plumber shouldn't have done what he did. My husband had him "repair" what he'd done. He had to bypass the one section he broke, so we lost a 6' x 2.5' area of leachfield. The health inspector told us to be very careful of water usage for a couple of weeks and hopefully everything will be ok and we won't need a new septic system. We've been using paper plates, hardly flushing toilets, taking fast showers, etc. But today the upstairs toilet overflowed after flushing. Does this sound like a toilet clog or a septic problem? We do not have $10,000 to put in a new septic. And the worst is the ripoff plumber charged us $775 for his visit! Any suggestions or ideas?

[mrcaptainbob]

Hmm....not sure if that plumber was all that wrong....interesting point you made....when the plumber 'poked it with a broom handle' and the toilets cleared. Sounds like the problem was the septic tank/field to me! It sounds like he broke through the pack on the top of the tank and let the air out. I'm surprised that part of the house purchase didn't include a septic pumpout and an assesment of the septic system. If that leechfield is shot, that's the responsibility of the previous owners, I would think. It kind of sounds like there's a blockage in there. Tanks should be pumped every two years. I do have an issue with that plumber on digging up the leechfield, though. Especially without informing you as to the why....

[Hube]

I agree with Mrcaptainbob ; Your problem most lkely is in the tank and/ or the leaching bed. A septic tank should be pumped approx every 3-5 years depending on the number of occupants in the home. The old saying "pay me now or pay me later is now in effect. Was this installation ever approved? Was a record kept on ANY pump outs?.. "Buyer Beware' still exists, but you should check this out with the powers that be.(real estate agent, lawyer, enviroment,etc) You may have some 'LEGAL' grounds to stand on, depending on the length of time you have been in the home. Let us know how you make out..Hube

[shadow]

Thanks for your answers. The previous owners had the tank cleaned just before being sold (showed us the bill) and the guy who cleaned it said it was in good condition. If we call the previous owners or the realtor (who is the sister-in-law of the seller) I'm sure they'll say the septic was always fine. We mentioned it to the lawyer who handled the closing and he basically said we were S.O.L!!
I agree with you that if we need a new septic system they're liable - that's what you sign all the disclosures for. How do we go about finding out for sure if in fact we need an entire new system? Do we have a plumber inspect the septic/leach field or what? We've only been here since Feb. 25 '04.
Thanks again,

Vicki

[shadow]

Hi again,

My husband wants me to ask - how can the problem be the septic/leach field if the other 2 toilets are flushing ok? By the way I called the home inspection place who inspected the home and they said as long as the toilets flushed when they're at the house then that's all they can do is say they're ok. We've also put in a call to the guy who cleaned the tank and on the bill wrote "tank is in excellent condition". We're waiting to hear back.
My husband saw a toilet at Home Depot that is guaranteed to flush every time no matter what, so we're thinking of getting it for the problem bathroom and then when he removes the old one he'd also take a look and see if anything is backed up. And if that still doesn't do it, looks like we'll need a whole new system.
It's not rocket science, but these plumbers try to make it sound like it is and get you confused. By the way, the people we bought the house from (just the two of them) only had had the tank cleaned once shortly before we bought it.
Could the one toilet not working sometimes mean the whole system is shot?

Vicki

[Hube]

In your initial posting you did'nt mention that 'the other 2 toilets are flushing ok'... You only mentioned the 2 that were acting up. Now your indicating there are 4 toilets, of which 2 flush ok, and the other 2 do not. Do you have a split system to 2 separate septic tanks. I would 'nt think so. Your problem is not only the MAIN line is badly in need of 'snakeing' and the tank and field bed need attention..BTW, a new toilet can be guaranteed to flush every time, but that doen't mean it will go to the septic every time IF the septic is plugged... Hube

[mrcaptainbob]

I do believe septic sytems are a strange breed! One of the four houses in our 'neighborhood' had their tank pumped once in over TWENTY years! Just before they sold it! NEVER had a problem!!! The rest of us always had ours pumped every 2 to 5. There should be a fairly thick 'pack' floating on the top of the tank water. That's a good thing. If it's more than a few inches though..then pumping is long overdue and leechfield damage may have occured. That's not to say, however, that it can't be reclaimed. 'New' or 'replaced' is not always the answer, although it's usually the first that recommended. here are companies that specialize in rejuvenation. Hubes right. Can you clarify some points for us? How many toilets? Size of tank? ANy other info?

[shadow]

3 toilets upstairs and one down in the walkout basement. 1,000 gal. Chamber system with no vents. (vents not allowed in Georgia)

[mrcaptainbob]

It's amazing the difference in regulations and codes from state to state. I would think that there'd be more standardization for stuff like this. I was led to believe that (This is from s.e.Michigan, now...) that a 1200 gallon tank is minimum and that would be for two baths/3 bedroom only. Any more of either would require larger tank/field. Well...back to your problem....The more I read your first note, the more I think the problem's in the tank. It would be a good idea to have that tank pumped asap. Verify the floating top pack thickness. And as soon as the level in the tank is lowered, note should be taken of the leech field inlet. If very much effluent charges back into the tank, especially with a 'whoosh', then you have a clogged drain field. That's when you start spending the bucks on either rejuvenation methods or rebuild. One possibility would be to find the ends of the drain field lines and backflush and rinse the lines out. THis is for professionals. They have the equipment and know how to accomplish it with maximum effect. Care must be taken with this, as there's much room for contact with pathogens and bacterias. I doubt that the ground beneath the leech field has been saturated beyond capacity to absorb. Maybe after 20 years of neglect. But yours is still young. But that can be revived, too, without redig and expense of 'new'. There's a lot of science out now on this. Let us know how you fare....