Galvanized Water Main Shut off Extravaganza

[palmieri76]

Just purchased 1941 home with all galvanized plumbing with the exception of the pipes running behind the tub. The water main shut off valve is stuck and will only close to about 95%. Plumbers have said we need to remove the valve and replace it and must replace some of the piping with copper pipes. They suggest while some walls are exposed in kitchen redo to tear out all the galvanized pipe and replace with copper. Partial job just around shut off valve $500. Full replacement for small 2 story with basement duplex (1 bathroom - 2nd floor, 1 kitchen sink - 1st floor, 1 utility sink, washer, water tank and two outside spigots - Basement) = $4100. This is just parts and labor and doesn't include ripping up walls, etc.

Necessary to replace all pipes? Smart idea? Please remind me why galvanized is so horrible. Reasonable price? What level of skill or certification is required of a plumber to do complete replacement? Are permits typically necessary? And should I replace drainage pipes too or just water pipes?

Many thanks for all responses.

[LazyPup]

While galvanized steel pipe certainly has a very long life span, which is demonstrated by the 61 years it has been in your home, it does have its drawbacks. One of the prime problems with steel pipe is its tendency to form thick layers of rust, lime scale and internal wall corrosion. In all likelihood the majority of the pipes in your home are by now restricted to 1/2 of there original diameter or less. With careful planning and layout they should be able to minimize the amount of actual wall tearout required to replumb the house.

Whether or not you would require a permit depends upon your local code authority. Here is Western Pa. and Eastern Ohio where i am currently working permits are not required, however, due to the myriads of code requirements, even if permits are not required I would strongly advise you use the services of a bonafide plumber to preclude problems in future such as if you ever decide to sell your home. Many banks or lending institutions will require a complete code inspection prior to approving a mortgagge and you certainly wouldnt want a sale to be held up while you pay to have it all done again.

No doubt your Drain, Waste and Vent system is run in cast iron pipe with oakum and lead joints. There should be no need to change the main cast iron pipe portion of that piping but, often the smaller diameter waste arms (2" or less) to kitchen sink drains, lavatory drains, tub/shower drains and laundry drains were made with threaded galvanized iron pipe, brass pipe or copper pipe. When galvanized iron pipes are used in sanitary waste drains they tend to corrode through at the threaded fittings, especially where the threaded galvanized pipe joins the cast iron. Copper and brass pipe tends to corrode through the pipe walls on the underside of the pipes. Given that you will have to open some of the walls up to install the new supply lines, this would be an excellant time to replace the galvanized, brass or copper DWV pipe with PVC.

You did not mention what part of the country you are located in, so it is difficult to offer any sound advice on prevailing wage or cost factors, however the price quoted seems to be a bit high. I certainly would not award a contract without getting at least three competitive bids.

In regards to what skill level is required. That is really a tough question. Where I took my training in Florida we were required to work under a Master for four years, attend college night school classes for the entire four years and submit weekly time sheets to the state apprenticeship board. All of that had to be completed before you could be considered eligible to take the State Mandatory Plumbers Exam. By contrast in Pennsylvania and Ohio residential plumbers are licensed by the municipality having jurisdiction, and usually it involves little more than obtaining jobsite liability insurance, workmans compensation insurance and paying an annual fee to the local authority, no testing required.

I would recommend you contact your local authority and find out what certifications are required in your area. If the certifications are laxed as they are here, then I would certainly insist upon references and check them closely. While checking references you may want to contact the local code inspector and find out what kind of a track record the prospective plumber has with their office. Also, when checking references, do not rely upon the worn out letters of praise the contractor may want to present, find out the names of recent clients or homebuilders they have worked for and contact them. Find out if the work was performed on time, to proper satisfacton and if followups were necessary. How well did they respond to the follow ups.

Please believe me when i say this is one time you do not want to just accept the low bid, some of them submit a low bid because they know what the quality of their work is.

No doubt you will have many questions come up as you approach this job. If you will browse through some of the other posts I have posted many of the code requirements to give you some heads up on what to expect. If you run into other questions please feel free to post them and share them with all of us.

[Troy]

1000th post LazyPup, way to go!

Try