Home Repair Forum

  1. Log in to remove the ads. Not registered? Register here.

    Registration is FREE and we won't spam your email.

Results 1 to 5 of 5
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    3
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    DWV New Construction Illinois

    I am new to the forums here and I have a few questions in regards to DWV.
    I am building a new house in Will County Illinois. In this juridisdiction we use The Illinois Plumbing Code.
    The house is a 80ft wide 2500 sqft ranch on the Main Level and approx. 1500 sqft in the walk out basement.
    I am on septic and well and I will be using a sewage ejector basin to lift the sewage up to the 4" Main Drain that connects to the septic.
    There is no mention through out the code in regards to venting the basin as except to say
    Section 890.1360 Sanitary Wastes Below Sewer
    1) Sanitary wastes which cannot be discharged by gravity flow shall be discharged into a gas-tight, covered and vented sump from which the waste shall be lifted and discharged into a sanitary waste drain by automatic pumping equipment.

    2) e Vent Sizes. Building sump vents shall be sized in accordance with Appendix A: Table K. Appendix J: Illustrations K and L.)

    QUESTION1: CAN I CONNECT VENT OF THE EJECTOR BASIN TO THE VENT AS A BRANCH VENT LEADING OUT TO THE VENT STACK OR DOES IT HAVE TO BE VENTED ON ITS OWN THROUGH THE ROOF. THIS IS A LITTLE VAGUE. AS I READ THE CODE I SHOULD BE ABLE TO CONNECT TO THE VENTING SYSTEM OF THE HOUSE
    Thats all the questions I need in regards to the sewage ejector or the basement rough-in.

    In regards to the main stack venting I have some questions:
    The codes states:
    Section 890.1420 Stack Vents, Vent Stacks, Main Vents
    Main Stack. Each building in which plumbing is installed shall have at least one main vent stack no smaller than three (3) inches for each building drain installed. (See Appendix A: Table K, and Appendix K: Illustration C.)
    It also states;
    Section 890.1560 Main Vents to Connect at Base
    Main Vents. All main vents or vent stacks shall connect full size at their base to the building drain or to the main soil or waste pipe, at or below the lowest fixture branch. All vent pipes shall extend undiminished in size through the roof to the outside atmosphere, or shall be reconnected with the main soil or waste vent. (See Appendix K: Illustration EE.)

    and in regards to sizing it states:
    Section 890.1580 Size and Length of Vents

    a) Size of Water Closet Vents. A water closet shall have at least a 2 inch vent.

    b) Size of Individual Vents. The diameter of an individual vent shall be at least 1 inches or at least the diameter of the drain to which it connects, whichever is greater.

    c) Size of Relief Vents. The diameter of a relief vent shall be at least the diameter of the soil or waste branch to which it is connected.

    d) Size of Circuit Vents. The diameter of a circuit vent shall be at least the diameter of the horizontal soil or waste branch or the diameter of the vent stack, whichever is smaller. (See Appendix A: Table L.)

    e) Size of Vent Piping. The size of vent piping shall be determined based upon its length and the total number of drainage fixture units connected thereto as provided in Appendix A: Table K. No more than 20 percent of the maximum developed length as determined from Table K may be installed in the horizontal position. Vent piping serving floor drains shall be installed in such a manner as to minimize horizontal vent distances.

    Section 890.TABLE J Size of Vent Stacks


    Number of Bathroom Groups


    Diameter of Vent Stacks (Inches)
    1 or 2

    2
    3 to 9

    3
    10 to 16

    4





    QUESTION2: Since I have only three bathroom groups in the house and only 27 DFU's(38 including the basement bath)can I run a 3" Main vent undiminished from the 4" Main Drain up through the roof.

    I believe I have a good handle on fittings to be used in the vertical/horizontal positions. So this should be it for right now

    I have attached a pics which includes a basic layout of the plumbing DWV as well as an isometric(THIS IS THE FIRST ONE I HAVE EVER DONE. Ii HAVE DONE PLENTY OF HVAC DIAGRAMS AND SIZING) so hopfully it is readable.
    Thanks for any input.
    Here is a link to the Illinois Plumbing code if you would like:
    http://www.ilga.gov/commission/jcar/...0sections.html

    Thanks again,
    JeffNmonee
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DWV New Construction Illinois-jason_plumbing_1_0001.jpg   DWV New Construction Illinois-jason_plumbing_2_0001.jpg  

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    chicopee, Massachusetts
    Posts
    2,318
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 29 Times in 28 Posts
    Hi Jeff, welcome to the Home Repair Forum,,

    I have read your post carefully. The Illinoise Code appears to primarily be based upon the Uniform Plumbing Code however I have found enough significant changes to indicate that I will need to take your questions one at a time and research them thoroughly.

    I looked over your floor plan as well as your isometric drawing. For the most part you have it okay but you have made it much too difficult on yourself. I am in the process of working out an alternate plan that I think you will find is much easier.

    Let me begin by answering a couple of your questions and as I work out the details I will be adding additional posts.

    1. The Sewage Ejector Vent.
    If you will examine:
    the Illinois Code
    Section 890 Appendix J
    Illustration K-Drainage Below Sewer Level

    you will see that it plainly shows the vent must go to Atmosphere. This means that it must have a separate vent through the roof, which would be in keeping with the guidelines of the UPC.

    2. The Sewage Ejector Discharge DFU Load.

    In your drawing you have correctly shown that the DFI load input to the sewage ejector pit is 11DFU's however that is not the DFU load on the discharge line.

    Illinois Code
    Section 890.1330(b)
    You must assign a value of 2DFU's for each gallon per minute discharge from the pump per manufacturers rating.

    The discharge line size must be computed per:
    Section 890. Table H- Horizontal Fixture Branch & Stack (DFU load table)

    Section 890.1330(b)(2), minimum discharge line size 2"

    MAIN VENT SIZE:

    Section 890.1560 Main Vents to Connect at Base

    Main Vents. All main vents or vent stacks shall connect full size at their base to the building drain or to the main soil or waste pipe, at or below the lowest fixture branch. All vent pipes shall extend undiminished in size through the roof to the outside atmosphere, or shall be reconnected with the main soil or waste vent. (See Appendix K: Illustration EE.)

    If the building drain is 4" the vent must connect full size, again 4" and must run undiminished in size through the roof, once again, 4".


    It will take me a little more research time to work out the remainder of the details.

    In the Master Bath I need to know:
    1. the horizontal distance from the soaker tub drain to the shower drain opening
    2. the center to center distance between the two lavatory drains.
    Last edited by LazyPup; 12-29-2006 at 03:23 AM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    3
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Lazypup, thanks for you replies. In regards to your questions>
    1. The horizontal distance between the soaker tub and shower drains is 8ft. I purposed to place a 2" vent 4ft between the 2 to meet code(as I read it).
    2. The lav basin drain centers are 30"

    Thanks again.I am glad I have found someone who is willing to share their knowledge of their trade. Funny how reading the codes and interpting them are two different things.

    I read about venting to the atmosphere with the ejector/I just assumed that since the other plumbing vents go to atmosphere that the ejector could tag along for the ride.

    JeffNmonee

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    chicopee, Massachusetts
    Posts
    2,318
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 29 Times in 28 Posts
    Sorry for the delay in getting back to you but after reading the entire Illinois Plumbing Code I have concluded that it is based primarily upon the Uniform Plumbing Code although the State of Illinois seems to have created even tighter specifications on some key elements.

    If you will examine the layout in my attached illustration I think you will find this is much simpler than what you previously had.

    The first problem I encountered was in the Master Bath.

    The horizontal distance from the soaker tub drain to the shower drain is 8' and both fixtures require a 2" trap and drain line. The Illinois Code (IC) limits the developed length of a 2" fixture arm to 4'. The code prohibits a flat horizontal vent below the flood level rim of the fixtures therefore If we were to run a line between the two drains meeting at a tee in the center we would then need to install a vertical vent at the intersection, and I don't think a vertical vent in the middle of the bathroom would be too desirable. The solution was to run the fixture arm to the wall behind the tub and shower and install a vent within the 4' limit. These two vent risers can then be combined in the attic space to one common vent before going through the roof. If you install an 1/8 bend on the top of each riser and continue upwards at a 45 deg. angle until the vents meet all of the vent would be considered vertical piping so we need not be concerned with the maximum 20% for horizontal venting. Both the tub and shower are rated at 3DFU for a combined load of 6DFU and a 2" line is rated at a max of 6DFU so we may run a 2" line towards the lavatories.

    The lavatories have an 1-1/4" drain line and they are rated at 1DFU each. Now here you will need to check with your inspector. The UPC and the IC only permit a maximum of one trap on a fixture arm. The UPC will permit two sinks to share a common trap if the horizontal center to center distance between the fixture drain openings is no greater than 30". The IC lists this method as suitable for a kitchen sink but it makes no mention of other applications. You should ask your inspector if the two sinks can be combined with a 1-1/2" center waste kit then fed into a common 1-1/2" trap. If not, you will need to install separate waste arms with an 1-1/4'trap for each sink and you will need to install a vertical vent riser between the two sink waste arms. If you can combine them with a center waste kit you can then install an 1-1/2" trap and arm into the wall with a 2" 1/4bend turning down and a 2" line down to the side inlet of a 3" Wye and 1/8bend with the 2" from the tubs & shower comining into the 3" Wye. In this configuration the lavatories will wet vent from the drain line below. The line must transition to 3" before the lavatory line because the 2" from the tub/shower is only rated for the 6DFU from the tub & shower and the lavatories are adding an additional 2DFU.

    You can then run the 3" from the lavatory location to the 4" main drain line. The IC only requires a cleanout when a line changes direction by 60deg or more, however I would strongly encourage you to install the Wye and cleanout as illustrated to simplify future line maintenance.

    You will note that the 4" main drain begins at the watercloset and continues 4" all the way to the outside wall of the house on the left side where it will then go to the septic tank. In this manner the watercloset will serve as the upstream cleanout for the main drain line and it will insure a good velocity of flow for a trouble free watercloset.

    At the washing machine you install a 2" riser and continue it up to the attic space for a vent. It can then be tied into the Main Vent in the attic space before going through the roof. Note: The veritical rise of this vent will only be about 20 feet from the basement through the floor up through the ceiling and into the attic. You will need about 5 feet horizontal which exceeds the 20% horizontal limit. The solution-As soon as you get into the attic space use a 1/8bend to turn the riser 45deg towards the main vent. Once it reaches a point within 4' of the main vent you may then install another 1/8 bend turning horizontal to the main vent. (The 45deg section is considered a vertical line.)

    You will use the same proceedure to connect the center bath lavatory. Run a vent riser into the attic space then tie it into the main vent.

    The watercloset and tub will wet vent from the main drain.

    At the kitchen you will have your loop vent then you will need to install a vent to the roof per the island loop vent instructions.

    The fixtures in the basement are primarily considered a separate system. Note that you will need a fixture vent connected within 4 feet developed length from the shower drain and the sewage ejector will need a separate vent through the roof.

    You also need a main cleanout within 5' of the point where the main drain exits the basement wall and another cleanout at the base of the main vent.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    3
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Lazy pup, thanks for all your help. In regards to the horizontal, that is a real good tip in regards to using the bends to keep away from the 20% rule.
    I will study this and let you know how all is going as the house progresses.
    We here in Ilinois are having a very mild winter(actually been in the 50's for the last few days.
    I may start digging in the next two weeks depending on the weather.

    Jeff N Monee

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •