controller lockout problem or other component problem

[Melo Properties, LLC]

I've been having a problem with one of my properties’ heating systems. The controller has been replaced a few times now because it keeps "locking out". My plumber/boiler tech' is stumped and can't quite figure out what is going on. We started with a Wilkerson controller and initially thought that the controllers where bad because the controllers kept going into lockout. We know have a Honeywell R8184G 4009 and this controller is also going into lock out mode. Does anybody know what might be causing this lock out problem?
I’ve been doing some reading on this controller “application, installation, troubleshooting…” and I’m starting to understand some of the components and the functions they provide.
What are the ramifications of replacing the cad cell with a jumper with the right ohms range? I would suspect that the controller would sense that the system is operating as it should be.
Could a clogged tank filter cause the nozzle to clog and trip the cad cell? The system was cleaned in September of this year and was tested to have about 83% efficiency. Co2, draft all seemed to look good. Or, at least did when it was cleaned. My boiler tech’ also did something called punching down the fingers for better heat transfer.
When looking into the boiler during initial fire-up what should the flame look like? Looks like a Yellowish / Orange flame of good size 2-3” diameter with ragged edges.
Any help or advice would be very very helpful Thanks Tony Melo Melo Properties, LLC

[HayZee518]

the cad cell is the first thing to look at in most all cases. the cad cell is the flame detect module. if it doesn't see a flame within a certain amount of time, it trips the lockout. the fan from the nozzle can have several configurations. could be a cone shape, a conical shape a flat cone shape etc. find out in your burner's specs which nozzle and firing rate it requires and purchase this type. if there's water in your fuel, it could be shutting down your flame. fuels float on top of water no matter how much is above it in the tank. 200 gal will float on top of 2 inches of water. jumping out the cad cell terminals won't help as the lockout circuitry is looking for a variable DC signal

[Melo Properties, LLC]

Hayzee518:


Thanks for the info'. I looked at it again last night and what I thought was a jumper was really the wiring for the cad cell. So I was wrong there is a cad cell in place even though I don't know where it is.

I sat there for about an hour last night and it took that full hour to go from 120° to 130° operating temperature. The pressure increased a couple PSI. The system is a fairly big system, I’m assuming, for the building about 5400 sq. ft. The system has two circulators one for the first and second floor and a third for the third floor.

What I’m seeing is that the system goes into lock out but the circulators keep running.

The guy I'm using is a master boiler technician and I do trust that he knows what he's doing. He's also a plumber but he specializes in heating systems (more of a service guy than anything else). I spoke to him yesterday and he said that he went in and cleaned everything again. He’s in the process of bringing in a 3rd generation oil guy that may be able to trouble shoot what’s going on.

The system worked fine last night (5:30 to 6:30) while I was there and when I showed up this morning (6:00am). So that’s one night without problems. We’ll see.

I NOTICED THAT THIS BOILER HAD THREE LABELS ON IT. IS THIS NORMAL? WE HAVE THREE LABELS WITH THREE SEPARATE MODEL NUMBERS. BASED ON THIS THE NOZZLE SIZE/TYPE SHOULD BE SOMEWHERE IN THE ARE OF 1.50 60° TO 2.00 60°.

Thanks

Tony Melo

[Melo Properties, LLC]

heyzee518:

I forgot to say that I've gone through two oil shipments (2 x 275 tanks). The third coming in soon. So i'm thinking that any condensation that developed during the summer is gone. I bought the house in May and the tanks only had 1/4 tank each. Is there a way to check / drain the water in the tanks?

thks
tm

[HayZee518]

the vertical configuration of the tan. inside beyond the shut off valve is a two inch internal nipple. any junk inside the tank along with water is trapped below the nipple. if condensation gets above the nipple it will go in your feed line. for every 100 gal dump in a fuel oil treatment available from most oil suppliers. if you burn diesel, get a fuel additive that emulsifies the fuel. diesel outside tends to gel into something like jello and it won't go through the pump. the cad cell location. ok, shut off the unit, remove the two screws on your high voltage transformer and tilt it back. inside you'll see the cad cell.

[HayZee518]

the circulators come off the C1 and C2 terminals of the burner control. Aquastat and thermostat come off the T and TH terminals. Static pressure will only go up to about 3 psi for a hydrionic system.

[Melo Properties, LLC]

I've had two days straight that it’s worked without problems. I’ll check the tanks for water anyway. But for now I’m in a “watch and see mode”. Thanks for your help.

Tony Melo
Melo Properties, LLC