adding a plug in outlet

[armataz]

I have a livingroom with 2 60 watt light fixtures each ending at a dedicated switch in a 3 slot wall box.
both have the standard 16 g. 3 strand wiring to them. I want to remove one of the switches and add an outlet.
the issue I'm having is that when I turn on the light.
the receptical does not work.
when I turn off the light, it does.
I'm running the deleated switches power threw the plug, to the remaining switch.
hot and constant in threw their top posts and to the switch threw their bottoms to maintain the circut. please tell me what I'm doing wrong to make this work. thanks TAZ

[HayZee518]

you'll need to be a little more explicite with your description. 16 ga isn't the industry standard. 16 ga is called "zipcord." house wiring is #14, #12 and #10 for circuits. from what I can deduce from your description you are series-ing the hot through your load. that's why I need a more descriptive explanation of what you got. make up a drawing using microsoft "paint" and post it.

[armataz]

thanks, its a medium guage 110, 3 strand line. heres the pics .
here what I started with

heres what I did.

[HayZee518]

OK, from looking at your first diagram I see NO neutral in the box so installing an outlet is NOT possible. The black/white combination you have on each switch is just a switch loop. Black feeds into the switch and white returns to the load.

[armataz]

thats dissapointing, but thanks.. this is an older home and it has verry few outlets living room only has 2 existing. I was hoping to add this one in. TAZ

[HayZee518]

do you have access from the basement or attic? adding a circuit is easy if you know how.

[armataz]

not really.. the attic has been converted to living space, and there is no basement, and I have issues with crawl spaces. I got stuck in one for over 6 hours while insulating. kinda messed me up and I cant crawl floors no more.
I did manage to add one off the bath and one off the bed room today though. so I'm currently up to 4 outlets. better then nuttin. TAZ

[HayZee518]

if you need additional outlets and don't mind surface raceway, wiremold makes some esthetically pleasing surface raceway. the newer stuff is snap together plastic, the older stuff was all metal.

[pushkins]

Bathroom outlets are not allowed to feed anything outside of the bathroom. Make sure that if this is what you have done and that if the bathroom outlet is protected with a GFCI (either in the bathroom or at the panel) that you put one of those little stickers on the NEW outlet saying it is GFCI protected, this will help someone down the track work out what you have done.
If you add one from a existing bedroom outlet make it a double outlet.

[armataz]

yes it is off a GFI, I placed the sticker all ready. and also explained to every one how to reset the power to the plug if I'm not there. and how to test the plug. I also wrote inside the breaker box that outlet is GFI equiped. incase the sticker wears/ falls off.
but thanks for adding that info for those that did not know.
TAZ

[pushkins]

My point wasn't about the sticker or that the outlet was protected, my point was that it is against code to have a bathroom outlet feeding anything outside of that bathroom. My reference to the sticker is purely to notify future owners what you have done, so that they don't overload the circuit, you have the knowledge of what you can and cannot run on the circuit, future owners don't.

[armataz]

why would be against code? just curiose?.
there are 6 other pre existing lines in and out of the junction box I used. one goes to a wall light in the living room thats what gave me the Idea for the outlet.TAZ

[Kman]

Is that part of the national code?

Around here we've been running outside outlets off of bathroom GFCI's for years.

[pushkins]

It is part of the NEC code Section 210.11(c)(3) (thanks to Ohm1)
[210.11(C)(3)]: One 20A, 120V branch circuit must be provided for the receptacle outlets required by 210.52(D) for all dwelling unit bathrooms. This 20A bathroom receptacle circuit must not serve any other outlet, such as bathroom lighting outlets or receptacle outlets in other rooms.

Obviously existing situations are "grandfathered" in but adding into a "grandfathered" circuit (new work) suddenly takes away the "grandfathered" part.

This doesn't mean it hasn't happened in the past BUT it is not accepted now.
It was acceptable and code, to run exterior outlets off the bathroom GFCI protected circuit years ago, the problems started to arise with that 1000 watt hairdryer running in one bathroom another gets turned on in another bathroom then the electric hedge trimmer gets turned on outside and that's about when someone plugs in and turns on the vacumn cleaner on that "new" bathroom spliced outlet......before you know it problems arise. Now we all know that this is a rarity (if at all ever possibility) BUT code is written to protect in all cases not just rare ones.

Again, codes aren't just for the current owners, sure they are there to protect current but most importantly future owners that have no idea what previous owners have done.

[armataz]

thanks for the explanation. there is a notation in the breaker pannel for future owners, if sold.
the pannel its self is new.
on this circut, there are 6 outlets 2 lights and a exaust fan. on a 30 amp breaker switch. is there a reason you can think of for them using a 30 amp in a new pannel?thanks